Pissing Contest

[rkold]

I think the mods at DoA are having some sort of pissing contest with the former DoA mods now modding Resinality . I know some mods for both/either or, might read this, but about right now I want to stress this *IS* my private LJ, and I do think so long as I am polite in the community I should be allowed to speak my mind here without fear of repercussion and without needing to flock.

I'm not sure which set of mods thinks the general users are dense, but it's quite obvious that the splitting which made Resinality was *NOT* amicable and no amounts of posting in thanks to the former mods will convince me otherwise. The very fact news is shared on one forum and not the other should make that completely clear. I don't care what caused the split, both boards can have a purpose. Groups and allowing an OT group is brilliant idea. It's wonderful getting a chance to see which members I share things in common with and others I don't and I can ignore groups that don't interest me at all.

But it feels like DoA has suddenly decided it needs ads because Resinality has ads and people like it there! (Now why they couldn't decide we need an OT section instead... )

On Resinality, I don't mind it, Resinality has less than 10% the number of members of DoA and just does not have a marketplace the scope of DoA. DoA has given its users a week to switch to this new form without having worked out some major kinks and issues. Could the mods at both boards please stop the pissing contest and think of the actual people using your boards? Or if not invite in some new mods who are not just your friends and can give you input before you make gigantic changes. OK thanx!

Comments

[ladybrick.livejournal.com]

While the setup on Resinality looks nice, I think it's very telling that hardly any ads have been listed since it was implemented. I know it's a smaller community and all, but I found the ad system enough of a pain that I only bothered to list about 1/10th of the stuff I have for sale on DoA. In the end, I think the new marketplace is hurting more people than it helps and will only end up having a negative impact on the community feel of DoA :/

[rkold.livejournal.com]

Yes, and is it just me or does it feel like it was only implemented because of the Resinality one?!

I just don't get it. I mean on one hand maybe more people will find my Leeke wigs but I sort of doubt it. I might use this reprieve to post a few new things in my old thread. >>;

[ladybrick.livejournal.com]

I'm a browser more than a searcher, so I'll probably be doing less buying. Although, since it will be harder to sell stuff, it will probably work out that way anyway -_-

The ads I listed yesterday are already stuck in the rear, so they aren't likely to be seen by browsers. There's just too few items per page. And if I change a policy element, I have to go through and change every ad.

This really just makes it harder for almost everyone. Catering to buyers doesn't matter if there are far fewer sellers.

[spiderlace.livejournal.com]

XD I noticed Cassiel's user title above her icon says 'copycat' as she was posting in the DoA New Marketplace thread.

It's quite a big rift. Aimee even unfriended all the Resinality mods from her LJ (even those she'd been friends with for years), and anyone else who even advertised Resinality on her friendslist.

[pure-trance.livejournal.com]

Sheesh, I wonder what happened x_X; It seems to me that on it's own splitting off shouldn't cause that sort of tension.

[thundermew.livejournal.com]

I LOVE the usergroups feature on R, and I could live with the classified ads there. Otherwise ... :X

[aimeekitty.livejournal.com]

I'm so sorry that this is bothering people outside of this, like you. I genuinely am. All I can say is that I have NO desire to have any sort of pissing match with any other forum. I know that people will have a hard time believing this, but the marketplace changes on DoA HONESTLY were not due to Resinality having them.
I honestly asked my server master, when we lost alot of our moderators, what HE thought we could do to improve, and this was one of his suggestions. I was NOT AWARE of the plugin on Resinality until we were already implementing it on Den of Angels.

All I can do is try to reassure you, as I have a lot respect for you, that I am not trying to have some kind of war or pissing match. I just want to make DoA better. We've been stagnating for a while and I really want to make, what I feel, are positive changes.

We're going to work hard to getting things working so that it's easier for people. I don't want to make it hard or scary for anyone. So please, have a little faith in us, we really are trying hard to do things to make things better for everyone, not to do a "ha ha! look what we did!" to ANY FORUM. Really. :(

[aimeekitty.livejournal.com]

guys, honestly, this is really none of your business, I don't mean that in a mean way, but I don't think it's fair to anyone involved to drag it out like this. I don't wish them any ill will, honestly. and it is not due to them making a new forum. Why are people stalking who I do or don't have on my flist anyway? Give me a little credit and some privacy please.

and as to the marketplace, please see my post below. Thanks.

[thundermew.livejournal.com]

I understand the reasonings behind the decision. I guess people are feeling a little blindsided by this, because it -is- a pretty drastic and sweeping change.

BTW, check your PP account pls!

[spiderlace.livejournal.com]

In regards to the friendslist, it was posted on an old mod's LJ who seemed rather taken aback by the gesture, with others chiming in.

[ashbet]

Hiya -- sorry to be coming in randomly, I was linked to this post and wanted to explain a little bit.

>>>I'm not sure which set of mods thinks the general users are dense, but it's quite obvious that the splitting which made Resinality was *NOT* amicable and no amounts of posting in thanks to the former mods will convince me otherwise.

Whether or not there were personal issues between some of the moderators, we are *very* grateful for all the work they've put in over the years, and it would be graceless and ill-behaved of us not to acknowledge that. Modding on DoA isn't a lifetime judgeship -- people are welcome to leave if there's another project that they want to devote their time to.

I'm not sure why saying that we *are* grateful is somehow assuming that the readership/members are dense -- it's a public acknowledgment of the fact that they worked hard in a volunteer position, and they deserve thanks and well-wishes for it.

The very fact news is shared on one forum and not the other should make that completely clear.

I'm not really sure what you're referring to, but I'm certainly open to answering any questions you might have in regards to news.

Seriously -- DoA is never going to have an OT forum, we're never going to go 18+, and Resinality appeals to a different market share. Nobody's fighting over membership, and we're perfectly happy for people to belong to both forums.

I'm not going to say that the break wasn't difficult in some ways, but the fact that some people chose to go in a different direction doesn't mean that we have to be nasty about it.

We're listening to the members about the Marketplace, and are trying to work the bugs out as we speak. We may or may not go with that MP model given the feedback that we've gotten.

-- Andi :)

[rkold.livejournal.com]

I occasionally search, but I want to be able to search and actually find what I'm looking for as well. ^^;

I have done some browsing though, it's how I bought my SDC Arashi wig.

And yes, only the largest sellers are still going to stick around, and the problem is sometimes we all need to sell so that we can be buyers. ^^;

[rkold.livejournal.com]

I had no idea. O_O

[cc-lemon.livejournal.com]

I have no real awareness of any schism between the DoA mods and the Resinality mods. That's really none of my business. I only became aware of Resinality today when another member suggested I check it out.

My main concern was that if we switched over to the new MP exclusively it had the potential to completely kill sellers like Gina, St. James and others like me who do both direct sales and commissions and frankly, the commissions forums are a sales wasteland, as far as I've noticed. Further, there doesn't seem to be any provision at all for sellers like Gina, who'd basically have to list every eye type and color and every size separately and that's a burden as well as a disaster in the making.

Rachel, you have no idea how much I appreciate you jumping into the fray with some very sensible suggestions and evenhanded thoughts on the matter, as well as with this post here. It's very brave of you. *hugs*

And, as an aside, I wish you all the luck in the world getting a Yuki next week. For as long as I've known you this has been your grail doll and no one deserves it more.

[rkold.livejournal.com]

As stated in my post you're all welcome to have a disagreement and I'm not asking for the details of what happened. ^^;

However, people will notice and all of the mods--past and present do need to understand that. For me, personally, as this is very near and dear to my own heart, I just noticed that Cassiel did not post in DoA about the Sato only event in October. The event was not posted until several days later by Ria Ria. Something like that will lead me to suspect that the parting was not amicable.

Again, I'm not asking for details, as it is your personal lives.

I generally friend people on LJ who friend me back and who respond to my posts. ^^;

[rkold.livejournal.com]

Usergoups and OT in particular is the most amazing thing. I love finding out things I had no idea about like Cassiel owns cats and lots of people share my love of Watership Down.

I don't visit the marketplace there at all.

[aimeekitty.livejournal.com]

I'm aware of that post. But it is really impossible for me to explain myself without telling information that it is not my place to tell.

I will always be grateful to the moderators who left and out of respect for that and our longtime friendship, I would rather not air dirty laundry. I do not wish them any ill will and I have no desire to have a war. I have to be able to choose who is and isn't on my flist though without people assuming that I'm being a bitch. :(

All I am asking is that people not try to make speculations when they don't actually know what is going on behind the scenes. Please?

[aimeekitty.livejournal.com]

unfortunately I can't control what Cassiel does. :( I can only hope that this will blow over and eventually she will post things like that on DoA again. I don't wish her any harm. I kn ow people will notice, but what can I do? I don't want to air dirty laundry or hurt the moderators who left AT ALL. It's not fair to them or to us. This is a personal matter. It's really unfortunate that it is effecting other people than just "us".

I'm very controlled about my flist due to some past problems, so,... I hope you understand that it's not an issue of me just friending whoever friends me. I used to do that and I just can't anymore unfortunately. I try to be friendly as well as I can be despite the limitations that that imposes. :(

[blastmilk.livejournal.com]

I friended you!

We honestly didn't mean to freak anyone. We should have done a beta period and had some hardcore sellers/buyers help us work out the kinks to see if the system would work for us. We'll do that.

We honestly appreciate the feedback, it gets a bit overwhelming sometimes. There's constructive feedback and there is whining: we have to balance the razors edge, and weed through all the "I'M TERRIFIED OF CHANGE!" comments.

We have nothing against Resinality, for realz! Had we known beforehand that they'd tried the same plugin perhaps we could have done some market research and saved us some trouble o_0

[aimeekitty.livejournal.com]

cc, I hope you don't mind me responding,

but honestly, if threads worked better for sales of your type, we wouldnt force you to use the new format.

We're giving this some thought and we'll test some things and see how it goes. If it doesnt work out, it doesn't work out. We don't want people to have to use something that doesn't work AT ALL for them, you know?

anyway, if you have suggestions on how we can do it, or other parts of DoA better, please pm one of us. We really are trying to make positive changes and to listen to what people say about how they like to use the forum best. I'm sorry if this seemed like a sudden and harsh change. we really thought that people would like it, which is why we added it.

[blastmilk.livejournal.com]

Just know that we'd never move forward with a deal breaker that would kill users abilities to make use of the marketplace. It just wouldn't happen.

We might try to make it work with the current system, but only if it actually COULD work, ya know?

Nothing is set in stone.

p.s. rachel, sorry to horn in! xo...

[blastmilk.livejournal.com]

haha! I just posted the same thing below (more or less).

I didn't copy you! I swear!

(sorry rachel - slinks off)

[rkold.livejournal.com]

completely OT, but I love that LJ icon of yours. ^^;

I confess, if you or any of the other mods had stated that you were making this change in hopes of improving the DoA server, I think you'd have a lot fewer complaints.

To those of us who are not mods and not close friends with any of the mods, it does come off when it is so sudden and no other explanation is given that the idea has come from Resinality.

I really love DoA and I really enjoy using it. I've been looking forward to being able to share pictures and information there after I attend the Sato event on the 6th. It is really hard to keep something fresh and I don't really know what to tell you to help with stagnation, though in my opinion the debate subforum has been very interesting at times. I don't always agree with my fellow posters, but I've enjoyed interacting there immensely. If you mean specifically market stagnation, well, it's summer ^^;; The market always seems to stagnate more in the summer and it hurts that the economy in the US is not doing as well.

I'm not completely opposed to the idea of moving to ads, I just ask that before we move it would just be lovely if we solved some of the new issues first since I personally think it is easier to fix before it becomes a huge issue. I personally am not a very good programmer, but I'm happy to ask my husband who is a database person professionally if he has some solutions on how to enact some of the suggestions.

A keyword format with perhaps examples I think would just be lovely. I would love to know when I am looking for a Volks wig, I'm only going to get Volks wigs and not a fur one or a Leeke.

None of my criticisms here or on DoA have been meant as an insult to individual mods. I think anyone who is a mod is working a difficult and thankless job. I just think this is a very big change and one that is important to me as I like being able to both buy and sell things. ^^;

[rkold.livejournal.com]

I don't like the new format because it makes it harder to have your sales noticed and there is already a lot of key word spamming.

[rkold.livejournal.com]

Can I be so bold as to ask where my LJ is linked to from?

It's not the saying one is grateful, it's just hmmmm the post is written in such a way as it makes the split seem completely amicable when it is quite clear it is not. Again, I do not want the details, I am not involved.

I'm specifically referring to Cassiel posting on Resinality several days in advance of Ria Ria on DoA about the Sato Event. For me, this particular topic is very near and dear since I'm planning to go. ^^; I kept waiting to see if Cassiel or someone else would post it on DoA and was very surprised when it did not happen.

Actually, umm why not? When I mentioned to my friend muscatlove how I love the OT part of Resinality, she was completely shocked that DoA does not have an OT section and seemed to think an OT area was a normal part of forums. muscatlove is not a doll person.

I appreciate the mods temporarily rescinding the migration to work on the bugs first.

I don't mean this in a bad way, but I personally find people adjust better to change if its done over a longer period of time so they can become used to it. ^^